Remove bootstrap support

Remove bootstrap support

['Clara Kowalsky' via isar-users]

Hi,

I noticed that with kas 5.0 debian-trixie and using own keys in 
isar-bootstrap, one runs into the issue that apt-key is deprecated with 
trixie.

With:
+PREFERRED_PROVIDER_bootstrap-host ??= "isar-bootstrap-host"
+PREFERRED_PROVIDER_bootstrap-target ??= "isar-bootstrap-target"
& setting e.g., HOST_DISTRO_BOOTSTRAP_KEYS
for the isar-bootstrap-host target, the do_generate_keyrings task 
returns an error:
sudo: apt-key: command not found

The isar testsuite is not covering isar-bootstrap.

The question is, is the support of bootstrap even needed nowadays or can 
it be removed from isar?

Best regards,
Clara Kowalsky

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Re: Remove bootstrap support

['MOESSBAUER, Felix' via isar-users]

On Wed, 2025-11-05 at 14:11 +0100, 'Clara Kowalsky' via isar-users
wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> I noticed that with kas 5.0 debian-trixie and using own keys in 
> isar-bootstrap, one runs into the issue that apt-key is deprecated with 
> trixie.
> 
> With:
> +PREFERRED_PROVIDER_bootstrap-host ??= "isar-bootstrap-host"
> +PREFERRED_PROVIDER_bootstrap-target ??= "isar-bootstrap-target"
> & setting e.g., HOST_DISTRO_BOOTSTRAP_KEYS
> for the isar-bootstrap-host target, the do_generate_keyrings task 
> returns an error:
> sudo: apt-key: command not found

That's a bug...

> 
> The isar testsuite is not covering isar-bootstrap.
> 
> The question is, is the support of bootstrap even needed nowadays or can 
> it be removed from isar?

I also expected that we can sunset the old bootstrap implementation,
but apparently this implementation just got a patch so that it can be
used for building openKylinOS via ISAR [1]. Looks like we still have
users on it.

[1] "bitbake: Move the preferred bootstrap assignment before including
local.conf"

Felix

> 
> Best regards,
> Clara Kowalsky
> 
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-- 
Siemens AG
Linux Expert Center
Friedrich-Ludwig-Bauer-Str. 3
85748 Garching, Germany

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Re: Remove bootstrap support

['Jan Kiszka' via isar-users]

On 06.11.25 17:01, Moessbauer, Felix (FT RPD CED OES-DE) wrote:
> On Wed, 2025-11-05 at 14:11 +0100, 'Clara Kowalsky' via isar-users
> wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I noticed that with kas 5.0 debian-trixie and using own keys in 
>> isar-bootstrap, one runs into the issue that apt-key is deprecated with 
>> trixie.
>>
>> With:
>> +PREFERRED_PROVIDER_bootstrap-host ??= "isar-bootstrap-host"
>> +PREFERRED_PROVIDER_bootstrap-target ??= "isar-bootstrap-target"
>> & setting e.g., HOST_DISTRO_BOOTSTRAP_KEYS
>> for the isar-bootstrap-host target, the do_generate_keyrings task 
>> returns an error:
>> sudo: apt-key: command not found
> 
> That's a bug...
> 
>>
>> The isar testsuite is not covering isar-bootstrap.
>>
>> The question is, is the support of bootstrap even needed nowadays or can 
>> it be removed from isar?
> 
> I also expected that we can sunset the old bootstrap implementation,
> but apparently this implementation just got a patch so that it can be
> used for building openKylinOS via ISAR [1]. Looks like we still have
> users on it.
> 
> [1] "bitbake: Move the preferred bootstrap assignment before including
> local.conf"
> 

Before blocking the removal of this untested legacy code due to some
not-yet-upstream-proposed extension, I would like to first of all see
that extension proposed and secondly get explained why openKylinOS does
not work with mmdebstrap. Or does it bring its own bootstrap?

Jan

-- 
Siemens AG, Foundational Technologies
Linux Expert Center

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Re: Remove bootstrap support

['Jan Kiszka' via isar-users]

On 06.11.25 17:46, 'Jan Kiszka' via isar-users wrote:
> On 06.11.25 17:01, Moessbauer, Felix (FT RPD CED OES-DE) wrote:
>> On Wed, 2025-11-05 at 14:11 +0100, 'Clara Kowalsky' via isar-users
>> wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> I noticed that with kas 5.0 debian-trixie and using own keys in 
>>> isar-bootstrap, one runs into the issue that apt-key is deprecated with 
>>> trixie.
>>>
>>> With:
>>> +PREFERRED_PROVIDER_bootstrap-host ??= "isar-bootstrap-host"
>>> +PREFERRED_PROVIDER_bootstrap-target ??= "isar-bootstrap-target"
>>> & setting e.g., HOST_DISTRO_BOOTSTRAP_KEYS
>>> for the isar-bootstrap-host target, the do_generate_keyrings task 
>>> returns an error:
>>> sudo: apt-key: command not found
>>
>> That's a bug...
>>
>>>
>>> The isar testsuite is not covering isar-bootstrap.
>>>
>>> The question is, is the support of bootstrap even needed nowadays or can 
>>> it be removed from isar?
>>
>> I also expected that we can sunset the old bootstrap implementation,
>> but apparently this implementation just got a patch so that it can be
>> used for building openKylinOS via ISAR [1]. Looks like we still have
>> users on it.
>>
>> [1] "bitbake: Move the preferred bootstrap assignment before including
>> local.conf"
>>
> 
> Before blocking the removal of this untested legacy code due to some
> not-yet-upstream-proposed extension, I would like to first of all see
> that extension proposed and secondly get explained why openKylinOS does
> not work with mmdebstrap. Or does it bring its own bootstrap?
> 

Ping - specifically to our openKylinOS expect. ;)

There are only two options:
 A) fix the isar-bootstrap issue Clara found AND re-add isar-bootstrap
    to some tests
 B) drop isar-bootstrap, maybe only leaving bootstrap-host/target for
    now so that downstream can still override where needed

Leaving things as they are or only doing half of option A) are no
alternatives.

Jan

-- 
Siemens AG, Foundational Technologies
Linux Expert Center

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RE: Remove bootstrap support

['Liu, Yi' via isar-users]

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Kiszka, Jan (FT RPD CED) <jan.kiszka@siemens.com>
> Sent: Monday, November 10, 2025 3:40 PM
> To: Moessbauer, Felix (FT RPD CED OES-DE)
> <felix.moessbauer@siemens.com>; isar-users@googlegroups.com;
> ibr@ilbers.de; Kowalsky, Clara (FT RPD CED OES-DE)
> <clara.kowalsky@siemens.com>; Liu, Yi (FT RPD CED INW-CN)
> <liuyi@siemens.com>
> Subject: Re: Remove bootstrap support
> 
> On 06.11.25 17:46, 'Jan Kiszka' via isar-users wrote:
> > On 06.11.25 17:01, Moessbauer, Felix (FT RPD CED OES-DE) wrote:
> >> On Wed, 2025-11-05 at 14:11 +0100, 'Clara Kowalsky' via isar-users
> >> wrote:
> >>> Hi,
> >>>
> >>> I noticed that with kas 5.0 debian-trixie and using own keys in
> >>> isar-bootstrap, one runs into the issue that apt-key is deprecated
> >>> with trixie.
> >>>
> >>> With:
> >>> +PREFERRED_PROVIDER_bootstrap-host ??= "isar-bootstrap-host"
> >>> +PREFERRED_PROVIDER_bootstrap-target ??= "isar-bootstrap-target"
> >>> & setting e.g., HOST_DISTRO_BOOTSTRAP_KEYS for the
> >>> isar-bootstrap-host target, the do_generate_keyrings task returns an
> >>> error:
> >>> sudo: apt-key: command not found
> >>
> >> That's a bug...
> >>
> >>>
> >>> The isar testsuite is not covering isar-bootstrap.
> >>>
> >>> The question is, is the support of bootstrap even needed nowadays or
> >>> can it be removed from isar?
> >>
> >> I also expected that we can sunset the old bootstrap implementation,
> >> but apparently this implementation just got a patch so that it can be
> >> used for building openKylinOS via ISAR [1]. Looks like we still have
> >> users on it.
> >>
> >> [1] "bitbake: Move the preferred bootstrap assignment before
> >> including local.conf"
> >>
> >
> > Before blocking the removal of this untested legacy code due to some
> > not-yet-upstream-proposed extension, I would like to first of all see
> > that extension proposed and secondly get explained why openKylinOS
> > does not work with mmdebstrap. Or does it bring its own bootstrap?
> >
> 
> Ping - specifically to our openKylinOS expect. ;)


OpenKylinOS does support build its own rootfs through both debootstrap and mmdebstrap.  
It just got failed when building via ISAR with mmdebstrap.

I am trying to figure out why it happens.   

Dropping isar-bootstrap might affect building OpenkylinOS in the short term, but eventually it 
will work with mmdebstrap. 

Liu Yi

> 
> There are only two options:
>  A) fix the isar-bootstrap issue Clara found AND re-add isar-bootstrap
>     to some tests
>  B) drop isar-bootstrap, maybe only leaving bootstrap-host/target for
>     now so that downstream can still override where needed
> 
> Leaving things as they are or only doing half of option A) are no alternatives.
> 
> Jan
> 
> --
> Siemens AG, Foundational Technologies
> Linux Expert Center

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Re: Remove bootstrap support

['Clara Kowalsky' via isar-users]

On 11/11/25 09:03, Liu, Yi (FT RPD CED INW-CN) wrote:
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Kiszka, Jan (FT RPD CED) <jan.kiszka@siemens.com>
>> Sent: Monday, November 10, 2025 3:40 PM
>> To: Moessbauer, Felix (FT RPD CED OES-DE)
>> <felix.moessbauer@siemens.com>; isar-users@googlegroups.com;
>> ibr@ilbers.de; Kowalsky, Clara (FT RPD CED OES-DE)
>> <clara.kowalsky@siemens.com>; Liu, Yi (FT RPD CED INW-CN)
>> <liuyi@siemens.com>
>> Subject: Re: Remove bootstrap support
>>
>> On 06.11.25 17:46, 'Jan Kiszka' via isar-users wrote:
>>> On 06.11.25 17:01, Moessbauer, Felix (FT RPD CED OES-DE) wrote:
>>>> On Wed, 2025-11-05 at 14:11 +0100, 'Clara Kowalsky' via isar-users
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>
>>>>> I noticed that with kas 5.0 debian-trixie and using own keys in
>>>>> isar-bootstrap, one runs into the issue that apt-key is deprecated
>>>>> with trixie.
>>>>>
>>>>> With:
>>>>> +PREFERRED_PROVIDER_bootstrap-host ??= "isar-bootstrap-host"
>>>>> +PREFERRED_PROVIDER_bootstrap-target ??= "isar-bootstrap-target"
>>>>> & setting e.g., HOST_DISTRO_BOOTSTRAP_KEYS for the
>>>>> isar-bootstrap-host target, the do_generate_keyrings task returns an
>>>>> error:
>>>>> sudo: apt-key: command not found
>>>>
>>>> That's a bug...
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> The isar testsuite is not covering isar-bootstrap.
>>>>>
>>>>> The question is, is the support of bootstrap even needed nowadays or
>>>>> can it be removed from isar?
>>>>
>>>> I also expected that we can sunset the old bootstrap implementation,
>>>> but apparently this implementation just got a patch so that it can be
>>>> used for building openKylinOS via ISAR [1]. Looks like we still have
>>>> users on it.
>>>>
>>>> [1] "bitbake: Move the preferred bootstrap assignment before
>>>> including local.conf"
>>>>
>>>
>>> Before blocking the removal of this untested legacy code due to some
>>> not-yet-upstream-proposed extension, I would like to first of all see
>>> that extension proposed and secondly get explained why openKylinOS
>>> does not work with mmdebstrap. Or does it bring its own bootstrap?
>>>
>>
>> Ping - specifically to our openKylinOS expect. ;)
> 
> 
> OpenKylinOS does support build its own rootfs through both debootstrap and mmdebstrap.
> It just got failed when building via ISAR with mmdebstrap.
> 
> I am trying to figure out why it happens.
> 
> Dropping isar-bootstrap might affect building OpenkylinOS in the short term, but eventually it
> will work with mmdebstrap.
> 
> Liu Yi

This should not be a showstopper.>
>>
>> There are only two options:
>>   A) fix the isar-bootstrap issue Clara found AND re-add isar-bootstrap
>>      to some tests
>>   B) drop isar-bootstrap, maybe only leaving bootstrap-host/target for
>>      now so that downstream can still override where needed
>>
>> Leaving things as they are or only doing half of option A) are no alternatives.
>>
>> Jan
>>
>> --
>> Siemens AG, Foundational Technologies
>> Linux Expert Center
So far, no one has come forward who absolutely needs isar-bootstrap. 
With that, I would go with option B and send the patch to remove 
isar-bootstrap support.

Best regards,
Clara

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