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Mon, 14 Jul 2025 15:44:24 +0000 From: "'Heinisch, Alexander' via isar-users" To: "MOESSBAUER, Felix" CC: "isar-users@googlegroups.com" , "Kiszka, Jan" Subject: Re: [PATCH v2] classes/image-postproc: Enable systemd units based on systemd presets Thread-Topic: [PATCH v2] classes/image-postproc: Enable systemd units based on systemd presets Thread-Index: AQHb5zz9R8SxOiGtoEW6I22R+2ySgbQxk0iAgABKlAA= Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2025 15:44:24 +0000 Message-ID: <7694d62cd98ea2fe226e394e9cc4e4b3002e648b.camel@siemens.com> References: <20250627082502.74292-1-alexander.heinisch@siemens.com> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: de-AT, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Evolution 3.46.4-2+intune x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: AS8PR10MB7349:EE_|DB9PR10MB5617:EE_ x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 4ccace0c-da66-46e1-7b5d-08ddc2ed4efb x-ms-exchange-atpmessageproperties: SA x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1 x-ms-exchange-antispam-relay: 0 x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0;ARA:13230040|366016|1800799024|376014|38070700018; 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charset="UTF-8" Content-ID: <2A72F9FDE8DE3B418FC31585593255FA@EURPRD10.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: siemens.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: AS8PR10MB7349.EURPRD10.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 4ccace0c-da66-46e1-7b5d-08ddc2ed4efb X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 14 Jul 2025 15:44:24.4028 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 38ae3bcd-9579-4fd4-adda-b42e1495d55a X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: Demb//oVre3IJul1W4LamxA5MWEmCDkYSQAM2QCrnoA3X9qkY34oEI9WEau7FdARV3tw4VVk5k+FGt88FdvqRk57ighjQAIn0j+aWl7x0kM= X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DB9PR10MB5617 X-Original-Sender: alexander.heinisch@siemens.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; dkim=pass header.i=@siemens.com header.s=selector2 header.b=eLBZ2Rb7; arc=pass (i=1 spf=pass spfdomain=siemens.com dkim=pass dkdomain=siemens.com dmarc=pass fromdomain=siemens.com); spf=pass (google.com: domain of alexander.heinisch@siemens.com designates 2a01:111:f403:c200::1 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=alexander.heinisch@siemens.com; dmarc=pass (p=REJECT sp=REJECT dis=NONE) header.from=siemens.com X-Original-From: "Heinisch, Alexander" Reply-To: "Heinisch, Alexander" Precedence: list Mailing-list: list isar-users@googlegroups.com; contact isar-users+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Spam-Checked-In-Group: isar-users@googlegroups.com X-Google-Group-Id: 914930254986 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: , List-Unsubscribe: , X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.9 required=5.0 tests=DKIMWL_WL_MED,DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID,DKIM_VALID_AU,DKIM_VALID_EF,MAILING_LIST_MULTI, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED,RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2,RCVD_IN_RP_CERTIFIED, RCVD_IN_RP_RNBL,RCVD_IN_RP_SAFE,SPF_PASS autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on shymkent.ilbers.de X-TUID: q78cHgBPw1Gj On Mon, 2025-07-14 at 11:17 +0000, Moessbauer, Felix (FT RPD CED OES- DE) wrote: > On Fri, 2025-06-27 at 10:25 +0200, alexander.heinisch via isar-users > wrote: > > From: Alexander Heinisch > > > > By default population of the presets is automatically done by > > systemd > > on first-boot. > > > > There were several issues with that: > > > > 1. The rootfs we get as a build artifact does not reflect the > > actual > > system running in the field. > > This might be intentional. We especially need to ensure that things > like the machine-id or ssh keys (machine fingerprint) are not > populated. We just populate services based on preset here. - no machine-id handling, no ssh key regen, or similar. > > > > > 2. For setups without writeable /etc this fails. With that addition > > it happens already at build time. > > We already had bugs in this area (no rw on kernel cmdline) [1] and > discussed with the systemd maintainers (Unfortunately I can't find > the > issue...). IIRC the answer was that systemd requires a RW /etc when > transitioning out of the initrd. Having /etc RO is only supported > under > some conditions (e.g. after a on-first-boot). Probably, you are referring to [2]. Imo, that does not help with true immutability (RO /etc), but that's something we were discussing here [3]. > > Unfortunately Debian itself does not rely on the systemd on-first- > boot > logic, but directly adds the systemd symlinks in /etc - which makes > it > inherently incompatible with sd first boot logic. How does population of services to /etc/systemd/... relate to first- boot? First-boot condition (apart from kernel cmdline) only depends on the existence of /etc/machine-id, or "uninitialized" in /etc/machine-id, respectively. > > In general, I prefer to have a concept in ISAR how we want to handle > the first-boot case, instead of papering over the incompatibility of > Debian-install and systemd first boot & vendor-preset over and over > again. > > [1] > https://groups.google.com/g/isar-users/c/dbxcePqSc04/m/a5y1HgGgBgAJ > > Felix > > [2] https://github.com/systemd/systemd/issues/14131#issuecomment-689643106 [3] https://lists.cip-project.org/g/cip-dev/message/19275?p=%2C%2C%2C20%2C0%2C0%2C0%3A%3Arecentpostdate%2Fsticky%2C%2CAlexander+Heinisch%2C20%2C2%2C0%2C113913313 BR Alex -- Alexander Heinisch Siemens AG http://www.siemens.com/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "isar-users" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to isar-users+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. 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